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Charles Adler Returns... (Again)

Updated: Jun 10, 2023

This week, we're back with another old friend of the show. Charles Adler was last on in 2019, and at the time, he was about to be on-air with Corus Radio. Nowadays, he's joining the ever-growing list of radio vets who have decided to go digital.

Charles is starting up his own podcast, The Charles Adler Show, in just a few weeks. We know this, not just because he told us, but because The Sound Off Media Company is going to be handling the production side for him. We won't be hosting the show, though. Instead, you can find him on Dean Blundell's network, Crier Media, once the show goes live.

As usual with radio-stars-turned-podcasters, we talk with Charles about what made him decide to make the transition. It does get a bit political, since that's one of the main themes of his shows. You've been warned. We also discuss the direction of his new show, as well as how he's had to adapt to social media, and the love and hatred he's been exposed to through the lens of Twitter.

As mentioned, keep an eye out for The Charles Adler Show on Crier Media. If you want to keep up with Charles in the meantime, you should also drop him a follow on Twitter or check out his personal website.



Tara Sands (Voiceover) 00:02

The Sound Off Podcast. The show about podcast and broadcast starts now.

Matt Cundill 00:13

This week, Charles Adler returns. Again. We had him on the show in 2019 when he was headed back to Corus radio. This time, he's headed over to the digital side. Joining Dean Blundell's Crier Media. And here's the disclosure piece. The sound off media company is going to be handling the podcast and production side of the show. This episode was recorded live on a Sunday morning in June, which means you can watch it on YouTube if you want. Now, Charles Adler joins me from Winnipeg.

Charles Adler 00:43

I think I think you did that. I think you had something to do with it. I was having coffee with you. Okay. All I know is okay. So correlation, and causation are not necessarily on the same planets. But all I know is one day I'm having coffee with you. And you're telling me about to Dean Blundell and some of the other folks that you're associated with at Crier and how fond you are of them. And the next thing I know, they're calling so I, you know, made the assumption, and I realized that, you know, assumptions sometimes only require feelings are not facts. But I made the feeling based assumption that you said something kind about me, because you always do, in this case to Dean and that Dean was triggered to do the right thing.

Matt Cundill 01:30

And Dean got very excited. And normally, like, I've always worked with the, you know, independent podcasters we give them a chance and a voice to, to get out there and do the thing. And you know, like you said tough to keep a good man down and you're active and alive. And well. I'm not here to say that you've retired to Florida anytime soon, because you've been quite active and you know, on Twitter, and I know you're somebody who counts your analytics. And so you are active politically on Twitter. That is a form of broadcast.

Charles Adler 01:56

It is, and I do Ryan Jespersen 's show me and I've done a bunch of shows as a guest but I'm a regular guests with with Ryan on real talk you've had Ryan on this podcast before he is one of the very very best that I've ever worked with. And so I'm honored to be associated with with Ryan I honored to be associated with you and and with Dean Blundell.

Matt Cundill 02:16

What do you think of people like Ryan who have taken- well who've been you know, shown the door by Corus or told their work is not wanted? And the next thing you know, you can do what we're doing right now in an independent fashion.

Charles Adler 02:31

Well, you know, it's I mean, a company can say that they don't want you associated with their company, you know, whatever, that's their choice. It's a it's a free country despite but some people on Twitter like to say they're free to do that. And Ryan is free to go on with his life and access his audience. You know, I'm my whole life has been small family business that's kind of you know, where my, my head got into this world, in my dad's little tailor shop. And so my dad taught me when I was you know, six seven, that the customer is always right there lots of ways to access the customer. The government expropriated My dad's a store because he was in the way of a freeway they were building in in Montreal, you know, well, it's your hometown, that to carry expressway, so that the carry expressway needed to be built my dad, my dad's store was in the way they they expropriated him. But what did he do? He went a couple of clicks up the street and opened up a another shop on Queen Mary road. They couldn't keep Mike Adler down.

Matt Cundill 03:30

I didn't know that that store had been expropriated to you know, for what the world's greatest trench. One big giant traffic trench, the big ditch? Yeah. Yeah. And that part of that part of Montreal, you know, now down in, he moved over to Queen Mary. And of course, had his- had a store and Queen Mary. And, frankly, Queen Mary was a much better location for him. And I remember when he was moving there, my my father taught me a lot about the small family capitalism. My father moved to an area where they already had three people who had stores very similar to his. And so I remember asking my dad, I was just just, I guess, beyond toddler stage seven, eight. I said, Well, why are you moving to a neighborhood where they've got lots of people doing what you were doing? And he said, because if I moved to that neighborhood, it will attract lots of customers for what I'm doing. And the customers will then make their choice. And within about 10 years, he was the only one left standing and that's not to disparage his competitors, but really, the market ends up deciding and the market of customers for tailoring and dry cleaning, became Mike Adler's customers. How did you spend the pandemic?

Charles Adler 04:43

Very isolated, you know, doing radio in the most isolated way I could, which is odd. You know, I did it from my home and I'm doing it. I'm doing podcasting from my home. And when I had to do radio from my home, I felt that I was you know, being punished by his straight because I love the smell of a radio stations with Robert Duvall and pocalypse. Now I love the smell of napalm the smell of smells like freedom. So radio is what smells like freedom to me and radio stations. But in this case, the you had the pandemic rad to do so I felt, you know, not very good about it. I mean, you know, it's easy to easier to get home after the shift, because you're already home. And there are some other advantages. I can be around my dogs, which I love. But I still missed the smell of a radio station now, in doing what I'm doing, you know, I'm thinking about someday if things go right, and and the podcast world evolves as it should I look forward to being in some kind of massive podcast studio with with with 50 or 100 screens, somewhere in the world, it doesn't really matter to me where, because, like you I live inside my brain, and my brain still craves big studio.

Matt Cundill 05:58

Do you think we'll go back to studios at all to get together in that? Because I think a lot of people have been sent home. And now we've got the workforce, man. Hey, I can work from home. Yeah. Is there a craving for people to go back to work? Yeah, I know you have it. But does do other people have that same sort of sense to get back? I don't know, I'm not. And I'm not trying to say that I don't care. I mean, I care intellectually, I guess I've got some interest in that. But Emotionally, I love the camaraderie of being with with fellow pros, whether it's called broadcasting and podcasting, communications, it doesn't really matter to me, those are just, you know, infrastructure issues. But as far as working with some other people who are involved in creative activity, old expression, you know, one and one is three, if you're working with the right people, the collective agency of that is going to is going to get you some somewhere, it's I think, to higher ground. So if you're asking me the question, do I miss working with fellow professionals in the same room? The same studio? Yeah, I do. And I don't, I don't, I don't apologize that if, if other people prefer doing it solo, that's fine. We're all individuals, but this individual misses the big communications factory. What do you think the legacy of media and the pandemic is going to be? Because you spent some time on Twitter, you took a small break at some point because it did become quite toxic. And then there you are, you know, you're back again on it. And you're seeing, you know, what, what's gone on? I guess this is my way of saying and asking what's what's happened to people? Um, I think there's, there's, there's an anger out there. And I think a lot of it comes from, from isolation, I think we are social beings. Social media, it's kind of an ironic name. Because social media has done more. To get the anti social out of the people than than anything I can imagine. I'm not suggesting that all of us have turned into, you know, the Unabomber. But I don't think that social media has improved the world, it has not improved our reactions to our fellow human beings. Obviously, I'm generalizing because I'm talking about an entire planet, that social media in many ways is very convenient. But in other ways, it turns people into shut ins. And I just don't think that we're rocks on islands. I think that we're human beings, who crave affirmation from our fellow human beings, we crave fellowship, we crave fraternity sorority, I don't know what the politically correct term is of still split things into he and she, sorry about that. But I think that the real world for real human beings, for the most part, there is a small percentage, just like in any group, there's a small percentage that are anomalous that they don't they don't apply to us. But I would say that well over 90% of human beings thrive in the company of fellow human beings. And social media has walled people off from each other, and created one I guess the term that's often used now is the silos I prefer silos for grain as opposed to human beings. But we're on these little islands silos, whatever you want to call them. And we're only commiserating with people on social media platforms who agree with everything we're saying. So they don't challenge us. We don't challenge them. That's a Faustian bargain. I find it rather odd that a lot of people will say things on social media, but then when I meet them, they don't come off nearly as crazy because they would never say all that crazy stuff to me and in front of my face. And I find there's more common ground with people when we do get together and talk and speak rationally. But social media is quite an irrational land. What's also phony I mean, or to use the more polite term performative people are performing they're performing roles, you know, they're arts, right wingers are far right wingers and they're they're far left wingers or, or progressives. I think a lot of it is, is frankly silly. I think it's silly that if a person is a it's a conservative, but they say some things that don't apply to the modern conservative model. They're castigated as commies and socialists, what have you. It's, it's it's juvenile. And it doesn't really accomplish very much except for for the troll farmers. And the troll farmers absolutely love Twitter, and other social media platforms. I mean, it gets them what they're looking for: Chumps. A lot of people- I'm not going to ask you to, like, put you exactly where you think you belong on the entire scale of, of a political spectrum, which I'm not even sure is the scale of any sort. It's could be just went big football field this point. But a lot of people will say that you're not really speaking for conservatives anymore. And they'll say, Well, you know, you've gotten a little bit taller. I think you've gotten liberal. I've heard just about every accusation made about you and seen it on Twitter, and it, it feels weird. And it's like they've changed know, you change and everybody wants to put everybody into a slot and not really listen to anybody's perspective anymore. Yeah, I mean, I have always seen myself as a small c conservative. I'm fairly traditional. I am for criminal justice being applied correctly. I think that, you know, some people do belong in in prison for a very, very long time. Yeah, they have they have rights, I think that we all have a right to a certain amount of the most important freedom, which to me is freedom from fear. And the only way that we can cut down on on on fear on needless fear is for government to be strong, and for government to enforce the laws. And when we talk about Canada, being about peace, order, and good government, I am very pro Canadian. I'm very pro Canadian democracy. And for most of my adult life, I felt that the Progressive Conservative Movement was the most Canadian, of movements, but the Progressive Conservatives died. And I have to just sort of admit that, you know that the bugle has been blown. Taps have been blown for Progressive Conservatives. And so you now have this radicalized Reform Party that is called the Conservative Party of Canada. That name means nothing to me, because conservatism to me, is a lot more refined, a lot more intelligent, a lot more human than the Conservative Party of Canada. And so when I say things like that, whether they're on Twitter or here on, on this podcast, conservative stalwarts, you know, the pure poly of crowd will say that I'm a socialist or liberal or whatever, then whatever the label of conveniences, whatever label is getting them the most amount of flex, but no, I don't identify with them at all. Safe to say that the party died in 2003? Yeah, yeah. I mean, they're, you know, under under Peter Mackay, under I understand why he did what he did he, he did his deal with with Stephen Harper, and he did his deal in good faith. And I don't think that most of Peter Mackay believed that the Conservatives once they united once the the Alliance united with the Progressive Conservatives, I don't think that Peter Mackay, who I happen to be a fan of, as you can tell, I don't think that we could make a thought that, that the Harper Conservatives would spend the next few years devouring the Progressive Conservatives trying as much as possible to smear them, as people who aren't really conservative aren't good conservatives, and aren't good Canadians and all of that. And I think that, that over the last number of years is has only gotten worse. You know, I'm very big on addition, I'm not big on subtraction. And I think the modern day conservative movement has eliminated a lot of people. I don't think that I'm the the only one I think there are many of us who who feel orphaned. And I don't mean to speak for you, Matt. But I have a feeling that for the most part, we're on the same page on this. Yeah, a shout out by the way to Acadia University. Peter Mackay is a graduate of there. So am I, I just have to get that mentioned and wherever I can. I don't know why I do it. I just do it. 2019 was when we spoke last I can't remember if it was before or after the Peter Mackay famous line where he said that the Conservatives missed an open net. And I feel that the last two elections have been that way that they are genuinely missing an open net to remove Trudeau from from office or at least get a minority government out of it. It seems like in the past, the math would have added up you can get a couple of maritime provinces in Quebec, but I don't think you can start building an election by Kenora. Well, yeah, he just, I don't I honestly have never understood when I say never in the last number of years. I have not understood This thing that the conservatives have have, well, we don't need we don't need half the country we can just work on on the western half of the guy and I'm a Western. I'm a proud Westerner. I wasn't born in the West but to the West has become my adopted home and Winnipeg is my, my adopted home that the places in Western Canada where I have been most at home where Winnipeg and and Calgary and everybody who pays attention to what I do on Twitter or pays attention. Over the years, I've said that loudly and proudly. But I have no idea even though despite my faithfulness, and my and my political proclivities and all the rest of it, I do not understand why the Conservative Party pretends that it does not have to acknowledge the mathematical power of Quebec, and the mathematical power of the parts of Ontario that it has trouble winning for all of the self evident reasons. They don't appeal to new Canadians. They don't appeal to people who are second and third generation Canadians, sons and daughters and grandsons and granddaughters, of immigrants, and I'm an immigrant myself, it's very easy for me to plug into it. It doesn't matter whether I immigrated in the 50 6070s 90s you know, whatever it is, it doesn't matter. I have no trouble understanding immigrants and, and the children and grandchildren of immigrants feel. And the modern day conservative party I would say the the post Peter Mackay Conservative Party alienates multiple millions of Canadians makes no sense to me not on it's not about it's not about morality. It's not about ethics. It's about mathematics. In the end, everything is about math. So I look at Joe McLeod, who hosts the podcasts on require media, I think, the 905 podcast, I think it's what it's called, and apologies if I got that wrong. But they talk about what goes on in the in the 905. And I think for many years, conservatives and liberals have taken a look at this area just outside of Toronto. I think it's, you know, mark up north and sort of, it's everywhere, around Toronto, and how blue, can you make an if you can make it blue, then the conservatives have a chance, but how, how does it look right now, for conservatives to to maybe pull some, like the majority of seats out of the 905. I know every inch of 905 because I spent several years working in Ontario. And when I was in Ontario, I was a professional Moonlighter. And I had a job and then I had two or three side hustles it's just the way it was, which means I spent a lot of time on the 401 and the 400. And you know, the QE and I know I know every inch of 905. And so it's very, very easy for me to understand why conservatives don't do well there. They did very well there when when Jason Kenney. This is the pre premier Jason Kenney, the other Jason Kenney, that one I was very good friends with Jason Kenney. Understood 905 By the way, Jason Kenney. A lot of people think because Jason Kenney was the premier of Alberta and he's well known for being an MP from from Alberta and a cabinet minister there. Jason Kenney was actually born in 905. He was born in Oakville, Ontario, another one of the many Yes, stomping grounds of mine. And so if you if you if you know, Mississauga, and you know, Milton and you know, Oakville and you know, all those areas, you know, who's been moving into those areas for the last 1020 30 years. You look at all that and then you look at some of the the rhymes and the slogans on Pierre Paul leaves, Twitter, and you say to yourself, What the hell does that have to do with these folks? How does it represent these folks? Doesn't work. So walk me back into again, the pandemic, and Jason Kenney is premier of Alberta. And I think you and him went at it on Twitter. Yeah, no, we went out well, no, we didn't really go out. We went out it on on the air. Yeah, about. This is June and it was it was April of four years ago. So approximately 15 months ago. We went out on the air. It was about a candidate of his who had said some really ridiculous things, you know, pandering to his social conservative audience in a church. So he was doing I guess he was doing a late pastor. thing he was I guess he was the guest pastor. And he talked about women killing their babies. You know, abortion, is what he was talking about. But he insisted on some women killing their babies. And then he insisted on the idea that men cannot love men, you know, is a homophobic message, your anti anti LGBT message, and it was really hideous stuff. And so I had Kenny, listen to it. Not that he hadn't heard it before. Although he said he hadn't heard Before, I guess I'll have to take his word for it even though he did a news conference about it a day earlier, I don't know how he would have done a news conference about it. He had listened to. But anyway, he did not want to take this candidate out of the UPC, but essentially the Alberta conservative that ecosystem, I didn't expect him to tell people not to vote for the candidate. This was just a couple of weeks before the election, I expect that he would do what both of us had agreed on the air about a year earlier. And Alberta conservative leader would do if they had a so called Bozo eruption, a previous leader of the Wildrose party who happens to be the premier now Danielle Smith, had a problem with with a candidate who was massively homophobic, is known as the lake of fire a sermon. And Danielle Smith did not want to disassociate the party from him. And that cost her the election. So Jason Kenney and I just talked about this on the air the same way as we went off the air. And on the air, we both agreed that if something like this were to happen to his party, his United Conservative Party Down the road, that he would simply say something like, look, this candidate is on the ballot, and it's a democracy and the people in the writing, want to vote for the candidate that that's there as the Democratic option. However, I want the people in that particular writing this case in Alberta writing, I'd want them to know that that candidate will not be seated with a caucus because that can be doesn't represent the values of Alberta the values of the United Conservative Party, Jason Kenny's values, and that expected candidate to say precisely that about this particular candidate, and he didn't, you know, he went into I don't know what you want to call it, the political mode. And I felt really insulted. And on a personal level, I felt I felt betrayed, because I felt I had his word that he wouldn't go forward with this kind of kind of nonsense. And that was an easy way out. And I thought he would take it plus, I just thought from a polling perspective, I mean, he was well into the double digits ahead of the NDP, there was no doubt who was going to win. And so the idea that he was desperate to, to pander to the people in that writing doesn't make any sense didn't make any sense. And it's not like that candidate was going to lose that. Right. And, you know, we know that in many ridings in Alberta and other parts of the country, that people are cemented to their political brand. And it doesn't really matter what the name is, because in the overwhelming majority cases, people couldn't decide the 70% 80% 90% of the time that people aren't voting for the candidates anyway, they're voting for the political party. So he had, he had no downside. And I don't know why he chose to do what he did. But you know, it basically put my own credibility on the line. I was known as a friend of, of Jason Kenney. And I was until I guess that night, when the friendship was was torn asunder, but I certainly wasn't going to have him destroy my credibility. I certainly wasn't gonna sit there and go, okay. Okay. Okay. I think Thanks, Mr. Kenney. Now, let's go on to talk about oil prices. I just I, I didn't let go. I was a dog with a bone. And then I had to ask him a few character questions related to his past. Past stuff that was on the record. And he just, he failed. He failed the character test that night. And I guess most of us failed the the friendship test.

Tara Sands (Voiceover) 23:30

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Matt Cundill 24:03

Why is it that so much of the nonsense that goes on is permitted? And I don't want to say that, that there's no cost to it. But there doesn't seem to be any personal cost when a politicians, you know, throws out a bunch of nonsense. I think there's a cost to the party. I don't think some of these parties are performing nearly as well as they could because of the nonsense it scares off. Maybe the progressive side or I guess anybody with a social conscience from from voting. But But how come people aren't paying personally anymore for incendiary views?

Charles Adler 24:35

Well, because the the people involved in in what we do are really afraid to alienate them, you know, they they feel that they're absolutely connected to the audience that has these people as their heroes. So a lot of people in my position simply would have let go would have asked a couple of questions of Jason Kenney about that issue and then moved on to something else because they wouldn't want to alienate him. And they wouldn't want to alienate his staff and they wouldn't want it alienate the social media that his staff gets involved with. And they would want to alienate his base, not trying to be sanctimonious about it. That's just not a game that I'm willing to play. You know, ultimately, I work for my conscience. I don't work for a company, I don't work for the company I'm contracted with those contracted with chorus, I've got a contract now with with crier, and that that's, you know, those are those are business relationships, but don't work. I didn't work for chorus or for crier, I work. I worked for my conscience. And if I am asked to do and I'm not suggesting chorus asked me to do anything and inquire is not asking me to do anything. But if I feel that I'm now having to work for the conservative base, and not my own conscience, well, frankly, that is, to me unconscionable it just goes against my ethics. People can choose to follow whatever ethical whatever moral compass they wish to follow. I follow Mike Adler's moral compass, my late father, he's on my shoulder, all the time, not trying to creep anybody out. I think a lot of people feel this way, about the people who they've been very, very closely associated with mentored by. And even though they're now technically in the in the past tense, you know, that the spirit of my dad is with me at all times. And I'm not going to do anything to embarrass him. I'm not going to do anything to embarrass the family name. And all that night in April, of four years ago, had I just, you know, rolled over like a rug, for Jason Kenney that would have embarrassed Mike Adler a great deal.

Matt Cundill 26:34

I sometimes wonder when leaders make decisions, are they I think they're going for social media clicks more than they're going for political power, it's almost like the game is over if they gain political power, because then they would have to govern. And governing is is hard. And in terms of being an effective opposition, I'm not seeing a lot of effective opposition, you know, across the country anywhere. No, you're right. I mean, they're going for clicks, they're going for donations, they're their staffs are going for clicks and donations, the moment they're their bosses, anything, they're immediately on Instagram or Twitter, tick tock, whatever, whatever it is, whatever their favorite platforms are, to see what kind of bang, what kind of coverage their leaders are getting on social media, that becomes the big metric. It's kind of crazy anyway, because so much of social media reaction is not even real. It's just driven by the algorithms, that the the troll farmers are so good at exercising, and Matt, I don't know whether this is a time when we should actually do a little bit of splaining. And I'm more into entertaining than I am into explaining, because I also want to want to keep the audience I don't want to lose them by going deep into the, into the policy weeds. But is it worth talking a little bit about how fake so much of what social media is all about in terms of the incendiary reaction that's coming from people who don't even really exist? Yeah, absolutely. We should talk about that. I mean, I'm, I find myself to scrolling past it, because I know it's not real, fake accounts, bots, just so much junk that that's out there. And of course, stuff that's, you know, driven and funded by dark money, I guess

Charles Adler 28:17

Yeah, dark money. Sometimes it's- sometimes that money is from foreign powers. Sometimes it's just the dark money that is associated with a particular ideology. So when that particular ideology is programming, let's say algorithms to go after people who criticize the conservatives, whether it's the conservatives in the UK, or the conservatives, in the USA, or Canada doesn't matter. When, when certain dark money is programming those those those algorithms, you end up the moment you say something that is not complimentary of the conservative movement, all of a sudden, all this, you know, all these replies and up on the and your Twitter replies, and I've said to people in, in so many different ways, just just ignore that stuff. It's, it's not real, it's not relevant, that doesn't represent the country. It just represents a, a fact of life in social media. That certain level is called dark money is a nice way of putting it. Certain people are invested in in their message they in this case, the the right wing message being the only message and if anybody wants to contradict it, they're going to be slammed, they're going to be bashed, they're going to be smeared. And and that will drive away those people who want to publicly criticize the dark money message.

Matt Cundill 29:33

So there's a lot of accusation that American style, right wing politics, those strategies have come to Canada. But if I were to look at that, it looks like it looks like a loser book. Trump lost three elections really. He lost the house, he lost the Senate lost his own the presidential election. So I don't know why anybody would want to hook themselves to that wagon. And then the midterms came up, and midterms that Gimme, there's the open net again, you should be able to make some substantial gains. And they did not. So Democrats wound up making some some key gains during the midterms are not a great record from Joe Biden. And I think what it really came down to was was candidates, how strong were the candidates, and they ran, the Republicans ran real losers. And I think this comes back to you know, just about anywhere, that if you're going to run losers, you're going to lose,

Charles Adler 30:30

Losers get you the wrong kind of publicity. And, you know, in the most recent US midterms, they went whole hog into this so called pro life message, by the way, I don't, I don't really understand how a forcing women to stay pregnant, even if they've been raped, even if they've been insisted I don't, I don't understand how you can call that pro life. I mean, it's just, it's such an inhuman thing you're torturing people is not pro life. That's just, you know, there it is, when I my so called progressive opinion, that's what makes me a, a progressive, the conservative. To me, there's nothing a traditionally human about the forcing women into any kind of behavior that they choose not to be in, because you're wrapping yourself in, in some interpretation of, of what the Lord wants. I just, I'm just not on that train. But in any case, the many of the Conservative candidate and the Republican conservatives during the midterms who won their primaries, and remember, primaries are only voted in by the most active by the most partisan of the players, whether they're partisan Democrats or partisan Republicans. They don't represent the mass of Republicans, the mass of Democrats was one of the reasons why sometimes the House of Representatives is not really representative of the American public. I don't want to go too far into that field, either. Except to say that in the midterms, many of these wacky radical people ended up being candidates. And so a lot of people who ordinarily weren't Democrats voted for the Democrats, because they just couldn't stomach these, you know, freak show Republicans.

Matt Cundill 32:18

Does that sort of cast away the- the myth that people will just vote down ballot though this Republican and then put X's all the way down? I think people are a little more choosy.

Charles Adler 32:27

Well, a lot of people, a lot of people do vote that way, where they just, you know, vote the entire the entire ballot. So every everything from the President to the dogcatcher is either all Republican or all all Democrat. A lot of people do vote that way. But some don't. And of course, in the midterms are a little different, because there is no, there is no president to vote for in the midterms, you're you're voting much more much more local. Not as many people vote in the midterms. That's another story. But in general, I mean, the general proposition is that for those people who think that just running the most radical of people on the left, and the most radical people on the right, for people who think that's a good idea of bridging the divide of uniting a country, whether it's called the United States or Canada, no, it's not a good way. And ultimately, it's not good for your political party, either. Because you're, once again, if you're just thinking about addition and subtraction, you're subtracting people every time you do that, and the American context, if Marjorie Taylor Greene becomes your, your, your poster person, if that's your representative of the Republican Party, you will lose a lot of Republicans, you will lose a lot of moderates, you will lose a lot of independents who might lean Republican, but don't want to be in the same postal code. Excuse me. We're talking Americans. You don't want to be the same zip code with Marjorie Taylor Greene.

Matt Cundill 33:49

Can you look to the future and tell me how you see it plays out for the Republicans, with Trump and DeSantis? Well, if Trump wins the nomination, and I still think that he is easily odds on favorite to win the Republican nomination, I think that he can be relatively relatively easily defeated by Biden or if Biden chooses for age reasons. I'm not an ageist, I've been inveighing against ageism for the last few new cycles here. But if he if he if he if he chooses to think that he ought to turn the baton over to someone else, I think that someone else, for the most part that someone else still has a good chance of beating Trump, simply because most of the independents who are generally sent her right to not want to have Donald Trump back in the White House. There are some people who feel that DeSantis is a great candidate because he's very Trump like, but he's a lot younger, and he's done very well. In Florida. I don't I don't see. I don't see DeSantis becoming president. I. I could be wrong. I think the Democrats are favored in any case, for the oldest reasons most incumbents were presidents. Most presidential incumbents win a two terms whether they're Republicans or Democrats. Yes, there are anomalies and you know, George W. Bush's dad George HW Bush, only one term but there are other people who say well the only one one term because he really was doing Reagan's third term. You know, and and Ross Perot is involved in that upset that particular applecart. The thing is that unless the Democrats do something really foolish, unless something really horrible happens to the economy, for the most part, or of course, if there's a huge national security issue, but for the most part, it's about the economy. Unless the economy craters in the next 18 months, I don't see the Democrats are losing the White House. So by the way, we need to get a name for your studio that you have there. We should probably put it up for some naming rights. But I saw you took to Twitter from your studio, and you talked about ageism. But you know, the I mean, there was a time Reagan was 17. We all thought that was too old. And now we're looking at Bernie Sanders, Donald Trump, and Joe Biden. It cuts across party lines. I mean, everybody is is over 75.

Charles Adler 36:18

Matt, would I- would I destroy our friendship if I mentioned the little incident that happened? Just moments before we started podcasting today?

Matt Cundill 36:29

No, no, you go right ahead and talk about that accident I had. So you seem to trip over something, it was out of camera range, so I wasn't sure what you tripped over. So why don't you tell us what you tripped over. So I put a new camera in. And by the way, I want to apologize to everybody for my whiteness today. White with this brand new high, it's not a high watts. It's a 1080 P. So it's a fancy camera. And this is sort of what the crier media standard is, is that we want to have 1080 P cameras now I've got a wide shot of my room anyway, I thought I would go and adjust the light. And it didn't obviously wasn't terribly successful, because my whiteness is just spilling out across the internet. But as it came around again, it fell over sideways and crashed. And I'm just thankful that it worked or I'd be broadcasting in the dark right now. But there was there was an accident where it fell over sideways. And I'm thankful that it works.

Charles Adler 37:22

So you must have had this accident because you're 80 years old, and you're just too old for this right? And I'm only making- I'm only making the point that Joe Biden tripped on a sandbag, as Matt Cundill could, as I could, as a million people could, whether they're eight years old or 18 years old. Joe Biden happens to be 80, but the idea of going after him for being too old to be in the White House because he trips on a sandbag, something that could happen to any of us, is ridiculous. Absolutely ridiculous.

Matt Cundill 37:49

So let me throw out something a little more hypothetical. And let's say Joe Biden doesn't run who would be the front runner? Well, the immediate front runner would be the vice president because that's, that's quite traditional. And many people who are elders of the party tend to automatically vote, you know, at least support at the beginning of the Vice President, but there would so that'd be Kamala Harris. But Kamala Harris would still end up in a primary. And once once you're in a primary who knows where it goes, the last time she was in a primary, she didn't do very well, at all. It may play differently as a vice president, I think the world of Kamala Harris just to you know, put it all on the record here. And I think she was ineffective prosecutor and when Kamala Harris was on Democratic Senate Committees, prosecuting some rather sleazy ethically challenged people. I think Kamala Harris, you know, carved them, several new ones, I think she was actually the that most people who see the Kamala Harris of today see a much quote softer version of the Kamala Harris that that made it up the political ladder as it were. However, once again, there would be a primary there would be challenges from other people. So who knows, but if you're asking me who the front runner is, right now, Joe Biden steps aside, it would be the vice president. Do you think Bernie Sanders has an impact on the next election?

Charles Adler 39:17

No, I think without being ageist here, I mean, I could simply say, you know, Bernie's past his due date, but I think that would be a just I don't I don't think it's about Bernie's age, although I guess he's about the same ages. As Joe Biden is just, you know, he's, he's just been to the well for that job too often. And the other problem that Bernie Sanders has, and it's not even talked about in the States, nevermind, Canada, Bernie Sanders refuses to become a Democrat. I mean, I know this sounds crazy, but the keeps running for president as a Democrat and he wants people to think that he's going to be available again and again and again to run for president that. Bernie Sanders doesn't Like the Democratic Party, and there's that's fine. I mean, you know, you can be an independent, there's nothing wrong with that. But if you want everyone in the Democratic Party to take you seriously, as someone who wants to be a standard bearer for the Democrats, at least join the party, pay the 10 or 15 bucks a year and, and be a member, it's just a little bit odd. And although some people say that doesn't really harm him at all, I've never believed that I think it's always harmed him. But if, if anyone wants to go back to the Hillary Clinton versus Donald Trump contest, I think it was Bernie Sanders that cost Hillary, that job, because Bernie Sanders was very, very effective for months and months and months of inveighing against Hillary Clinton for two things. One, the vote that she cast to side with George W. Bush, going into the war on Iraq, Hillary Clinton tried to spend that in a number of ways. Ultimately, she ended up apologizing for that vote. Bernie Sanders went after her day after day after day for voting to commit Americans to a war in Iraq. And the other thing that Bernie Sanders went after her on, was the fact that she did all these speeches on Wall Street for Goldman Sachs and other firms, and that she didn't want to release the transcripts of those speeches at creating this impression that she said something to them that was politically untoward. And then that really caused her then of course, there was a business about the emails, but Bernie Sanders didn't go after her on emails, he went after her on her connections to Wall Street to big money, and to the war in Iraq. And I think that that cost her with a number of base Democrats, and I think it took them out of the campaign. They didn't want to vote for her. They didn't want to campaign for her. And I think that's what delivered Donald Trump a relatively relatively room service election. I don't think we'd be talking about Donald Trump right now. If it hadn't been for for Bernie Sanders' efforts in that campaign to destroy, politically destroy, Hillary Clinton.

Matt Cundill 42:04

And with an assist to the Russians.

Charles Adler 42:06

Oh, yeah, the Russians get an assist. Lots of people, you know, CNN gets an assist. I mean, even though CNN has spent a number of years and of course, is a relatively new and different CNN right now, which I don't think is very good, actually. But even though CNN positioned itself is very anti Trump, CNN just kept giving Trump exposure because when Trump was on, viewership was up. And producers were just told to, you know, let Trump call him anytime he wants to, because it gets us viewers. And so I think CNN also contributed, and obviously Fox contributed to Fox was much more openly pro Trump and Trump was on the Fox a lot. But But Fox is, for the most part, the loyal Republican base, you know, it's preaching to the choir, but with the Democrats and Republicans sharing a lot of the viewers and independent sharing a lot of viewers on CNN, in the days when CNN had much bigger numbers trumping on CNN all the time, really helped. It's impossible for me to sit here and not admit that CNN also played a role in in the Trump era.

Matt Cundill 43:11

Well, I think both those networks are feeding into all sorts of like Looney Tunes like Marjorie Taylor Greene in the Jewish space lasers. And when I hear that stuff come out, and all the nuttiness, what am I supposed to think about Hillary's emails and Hunter Biden's laptop? I don't even know if there's a serious because I don't even think serious stuff is being reported. So how is anybody supposed to decipher what is truly a problem and what isn't?

Charles Adler 43:34

You know, I'm never gonna say that Hunter Biden doesn't have severe personal problems. I mean, he obviously is a person who is required to rehab for a reason. But of course, the Republicans have really dined out on the the Hunter Biden thing. They've taken it to all sorts of interesting places, conspiratorial places, as far as Hillary Clinton's email, and the server. Should she have had her own server know that she make mistakes on that front? Yes. Did she wait way too long before offering explanations and apologies? Yes. Is Hillary Clinton a fabulous retail politician? No. But is Hillary Clinton better for American stability for World stability? Is it better to have someone who wants to challenge Putin as opposed to kiss his ring? Of course, of course, she is. I mean, you know, there's all sorts of lines about how you only have a limited amount of choices on the ballot. It's not between, you know, this particular choice and the Lord. It's, it's this particular choice versus versus Donald Trump. To me. That was an easy choice, even though in the American context, and I worked in America for a number of years. Nobody would have mistaken me for being a liberal Democrat or even a moderate Democrat. I was associated with the the Republicans, I put all my cards On the table, just as I was associating Canada with the conservatives, so these different people can tag me with all sorts of names and make claims that I've made these incredible, you know, changes and been, you know, Machiavellian, and all the rest of the stuff that is ascribed to me. I don't think that at the core, I'm any different today than I was when I was, you know, seven years old working in my daddy's store.

Matt Cundill 45:26

What can we expect from your show?

Charles Adler 45:29

You could actually expect what you're- what you're getting right now, Matt. you can expect as someone who is spontaneous, as someone who's relatively speaking, animated, very alive, very tuned into what's going on right now very tuned into the, the human condition. I think that I do still over the years, despite more successes than any human being deserves, and therefore the privileges of of those success, I think that I still have a common touch. I don't think that age is taken away from me. I don't speak any more slowly. I don't need people to complete my sentences. For me, I do think I have three things that are absolute necessary ingredients for any personality who expects to command a significant audience and those three things in this order, our intelligence, a sense of humor, and the most important one, empathy. I still think that, despite every nice thing that has happened to yours truly, I still think I can walk a mile in anyone's shoes. I think I'm a pretty good listener. And most important, and this once again, introduces my my father to this conversation. My father is the most honest person that I've ever met. I'd love to be half as honest as my dad. It just incredible, incredible capacity for honesty, for integrity for for strong values. And I still think I'm a pretty, pretty honest guy. There was a great country song a number of years ago, more than 40 years ago, I guess, that in my brain was playing all the time, it's still under the turntable of my mind. It's by a country artists called John Conley called the common man. I'm a common van common man, and I drive a common van. And my dog doesn't have a pedigree. Well, I don't drive a van and my dog does have a degree, but I still think I'm in touch with a common man, I love that tune. I love the spirit of it. And that's who I am. And I think that whether it's a broadcast or podcast that still connects with with common people.

Matt Cundill 47:33

Good and you know, one of the things that you and I have talked about is the ability to go live, we're doing something live right now. You happen to be very good at it. Over the last number of years my company has been working with on demand audio so I've learned to kind of turn audio into you know, think a little bit more Netflix when it comes to this stuff, but you're not afraid just to turn it on and turn on your Twitter and go live now just go.

Charles Adler 47:56

The thing is, and I'm not suggesting you're trying to conceal anything, because you know, we all have different needs for control of you know, for perfection, and I don't mind being bruised up the odd time having a little bit of the pie on my face having a little crow to eat, but I do love live I love the energy of live I love knowing that right now we are in the moment with people there's a there's an energy to that, that I really relish. It's the sandbox that I play in.

Matt Cundill 48:26

Good, well we're gonna get you some pathways out there. I mean, YouTube, Twitter, which I know you're you're active on every single day and if you're not following Charles do so right now. It's at Charles Adler, super, super easy to do that. And Twitter is changing as well. Twitter is now becoming a little bit more live. I think Elon Musk is you know, opened it up to Donald Trump a bit who's and who's the other guy? Oh, Tucker Carlson. Tucker Carlson has now taken his act to Twitter. And so you know, it's becoming a little bit more of more video heavy and there's certainly a little bit more content out there to be consumed. It's more than tweets.

Charles Adler 49:02

Yeah, I prefer- by the way, I- Twitter's been, Twitter has been very good to me for the most part. And it's gotten me a lot of play a lot of exposure with really good people around the world. If anyone is looking for me to become a Twitter basher not happening. I'm not I'm not here to stroke Elon Musk or or any of the people that you've talked about. That's not the issue at all. To me, the issue is, does the platform allow me to access as many good people as possible on this good planet? Yes, it does. And as long as it does, I'm with Twitter.

Matt Cundill 49:35

I found it really interesting that a lot of people decided to go and leave Twitter for whatever reason, and then they realized that their audiences don't live in other places necessarily. And from the I think it was Edison Research that you know, do their homework on Twitter, and even tech survey from from Jacobs media, but the numbers didn't drop for Twitter. Twitter usage is the same as it ever was. And the CBC left And then they came back. I thought that was humorous. Is the CDC back on Twitter? Yeah. All right. Well, welcome back. We're leaving. Okay, we're back. Charles, thanks so much for doing this and joining me on the podcast.

Charles Adler 50:14

Thank you and, and you never have to apologize. I gotta, I gotta say something, folks. One of the reasons I'm so happy to be associated with Matt Cundill is because he is so meticulous when it comes to audio and video and you have no idea how difficult this is for him today. Because on this particular podcast, he does not have the exact lighting that he wants. He's convinced it makes a difference in terms of getting out his message. It doesn't. You're beautiful. I love you. I love being associated with you.

Matt Cundill 50:44

Thanks, Charles.

Tara Sands (Voiceover) 50:45

The Sound Off Podcast is written and hosted by Matt Cundill. Produced by Evan Surminski. Edited by Chloe Emond-Lane. Social media by Aidan Glassey. Another great creation from the Sound Off Media Company. There's always more at


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